Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2006 04:24:50 GMT -------------- BEGIN bread-bakers.v106.n037 -------------- 001 - "Deborah Bede" Subject: Substituting starter for yeast Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2006 08:29:09 -0400 I was reminded by Mike's informative posting that I have a question: Can anyone tell me how to substitute starter for yeast in recipes for things like pancakes, pizza crust, muffins, etc? What volume of starter? Do you modify the other ingredients? Do you let the dough sit and proof before baking? I've baked lots of sourdough bread, in fact I almost never use yeast, but I'm hesitant to branch out and try other things without some guidance. Thanks, Deborah --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n037.2 --------------- From: "mike fuller" Subject: escaped cinammon roll fillings Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2006 09:53:27 -0400 shirley said >I followed the instructions leaving a one inch border all around the >edges of the dough when brushing with butter and sprinkling the >cinnamon and sugar mix on. I rolled it and pinched all seams to >completely seal. Placed it seam side down for the second rise and >placed the two loaves in the oven. All was going well, a good oven >spring and they were browning beautifully. Next thing I smelled was >burning sugar. Both loaves opened up a portion of the seam and the >cinnamon sugar syrup was escaping and bubbled over the top of the >bread pans. Once cooled I cut into the bread and the swirl was >there and had not separated leaving a gap which has happened for >other swirl breads. It was very pretty but I am asking for help as >to why it opened up allowing the mixture to escape. Anyone? well, shirl, i too have had the unfortunate experience of escaped cinrol fillings since my local police department has no division for retrieving delinquent bread ingredients, i had to find another solution i use a clean 2" paint scraper, spatula style, to provide ventilation so the generated steam can escape without busting the roll i first push it into the center of the roll, then one about 2" from either end, then one in between each of those, then one between each of those, leaving 9 deep slits, going almost to the bottom of the roll. i choose nine because that makes ten pre-cut pieces into which the log can be divided this works shirley, guaranteed, but takes a little practice. you have to jiggle around the scraper a little, and be careful to get almost all the way to the bottom without breaking through. but in the end it has a nice aesthetic result and keeps the errant spices, butter and sugars in their place baked love, mike in havana --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n037.3 --------------- From: "Mary Fisher" Subject: Re: excess starter Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2006 15:07:56 +0100 >As to discarding starter, it hurts me to do that... it's a waste. Yes, I always wondered why that was done. why not begin with smaller quantities? >So, I use the excess starter to make pizza shells, carrot muffins, >pancakes or other goodies. That's an idea, thanks! Mary --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n037.4 --------------- From: "mike fuller" Subject: another thing Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2006 10:47:11 -0400 irene when you stick the dough together along the seam, run your fingers under a small stream of tap water and carefully dampen where the two doughs come together this works like glue and makes a better seal mike --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n037.5 --------------- From: "Allen Cohn" Subject: Re: when to feed starter? Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2006 09:22:03 -0700 Here's another way to justify using start just at the same point when one would normally refresh it: When one makes bread using yeast, one measures it out so that you consistently have the same number of yeast cells in the dough. By using the sourdough starter just at the refreshment point, one can have the same confidence that one is putting the same number of yeast and bacteria cells in. Here's why: Mike's post suggests a "steady state" feeding schedule of 300 units of old starter to make 780 units of new starter. To simplify the math, let's use 200 units to make 800 units. At the point one is about to about to refresh the old starter, let's say that one's old 800 units has a certain amount of yeast bacteria cells. Since we only use 200 out of 800 units of the old starter to make the refreshed starter and the other ingredients in starter have no significant amounts of yeast or bacteria, then the refreshed starter will have the same mass as the old starter, but only 1/4 the number yeast and bacteria cells. So if one uses this newly refreshed starter to make bread, the dough will only have 1/4 the leavening and souring power. My understanding is that feeding schedules such as the one Mike provided are designed so that the yeast and bacteria have just enough time to multiply back to their original populations before the next refreshment. So by the time the starter matures (is ready for another refreshment), the yeast and bacteria populations have increased by a factor of four (in this example)...right back to the original population level. And as a side benefit of this tuned, steady state refreshment schedule, one can have confidence that mature starter has the right population density of yeast and bacteria. I hope this perspective helps. Allen Home baker San Francisco --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n037.6 --------------- From: yguaba@yahoo.com.br Subject: Re: rustic breads and prezel bread Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 17:10:48 -0300 On 6 Sep 2006 at 09:24, Karen Thornton wrote: >I am also looking for a recipe for pretzel bread. Not necessarily >shaped like a pretzel but one that has that "pretzel taste" A couple of years ago Andreas Wagner posted a message to this list suggesting this recipe (which is still online, as I just checked the link): . According to Andreas, this recipe works well, but it's difficult to achieve the original pretzel crust in a regular home kitchen. I've been planning to try this recipe ever since. If you do, let us know how it turned out. Best wishes, Erik --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n037.7 --------------- From: BLONDEMOMLADY@aol.com Subject: Unsealed Breakfast Brioche Date: Tue, 12 Sep 2006 21:18:22 EDT Shirley, I make this bread all the time for holidays, birthdays, and just because people I work with like it. When sealing the edges, fold it up. Also, make sure the bread dough has time enough to rise to the edge of the pan. You'd have had to rolled it tightly enough that you did not get the spaces in between the swirls, so that and the fact you left the one-inch border is important. Now that I've written this, I guess I'll have to get up in the morning and make one, because it sounds so good! Good luck, Cyndi --------------- END bread-bakers.v106.n037 --------------- Copyright (c) 1996-2006 Regina Dwork and Jeffrey Dwork All Rights Reserved