Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2006 08:45:10 GMT -------------- BEGIN bread-bakers.v106.n046 -------------- 001 - "Werner Gansz" Subject: Thawing bread Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 08:50:46 -0500 Fredericka, I freeze bread all the time. There are only two of us and even a simple 3 cup bread recipe results in more bread than we eat in a day. As soon as the bread has cooled, tightly wrap each loaf in aluminum foil. Then put the loaf in a freezer bag, removing as much air as possible and freeze. 1. To thaw any loaf, preheat the oven to 500 F. Remove the loaf from the bag but keep the aluminum foil on. Put the loaf in the oven. Depending on the size of the loaf, it will take at least 20 - 30 minutes for the heat to penetrate the foil and thaw the bread. Use a thermometer (stick it right though the foil) the first few times for each size loaf until you get a feel for how long each size takes. All you want is for the center to get into the 50's F. It will warm further before it is done. 2. Once the loaf is thawed, turn of the oven, remove the loaf and unwrap the foil. Return the loaf to the oven for 3 - 5 minutes to dry the crust. Leave the oven door open for this step. Bread that has been frozen generally has a crisper, cracklier crust than it had before freezing so don't leave the naked loaf in the hot oven too long. The crust might just turn to crumbs. The foil protects the bread from both freezer burn and from toasting in the hot oven and it retains the moisture in crumb. 3. Quick thaw for smaller loaves, like rolls or batards that fit into a toaster oven - remove loaf from the freezer bag but leave foil on, put it in a toaster oven. On the toaster cycle, turn the toaster oven on for its maximum time or darkest setting. Leave the loaf in the oven for at least 15 minutes after the toaster turns off. Finally, remove the foil and put loaf back into the toaster for a few minutes to dry the crust. Again the foil protects the crust from burning and retains moisture. Werner --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.2 --------------- From: Ellen Lee Subject: bread machine Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 10:26:17 -0500 King Arthur now offers a new Zo mini machine. http://www.kingarthurflour.com/shop/detail.jsp?select=C82&byCategory=C144&id=4342 I don't know if the price fits your budget, but if it does you can contact King Arthur about compatibility with a 220 converter. The description doesn't give that information. Ellen Lee --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.3 --------------- From: Raj B Apte Subject: refrigerator sourdough Ancienne Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 12:45:23 -0800 (PST) Hi All, I wanted to let people know about a slight modification to levain that I have been baking semi-weekly for the last month. It comes from experimenting with Ancienne from the Baker's Apprentice. The trick is to do all but proving in the refrigerator. My procedure is to use 100% hydration barm. Immediately upon refreshing (with RT flour and water), the barm is return to the fridge. It takes 48-72 hours in my fridge to double in size. At least 12 hours after it has done so, I build a loaf with 70% barm, 70% total hydration, 2% total salt (by total I mean including the flour and water in the barm). This dough is stirred for 1 minute and placed in the fridge. In 2 days it nearly doubles. I remove from the fridge, do a vigorous turn/punch by stretching and folding both lengthwise and widthwise, shape, and prove in a basket/couche. In 2-3 hours its ready to bake (475 F for 20 min, 400 for 20 min). The method works for white or 20% whole wheat/80% white flours. Kneading is 1 minute of mixing and 1 minute of stretch/fold. The flavor has no detectable acidity and I think it combines Ancienne and levain very well. To get a levain that likes the fridge takes several refreshments in the fridge, but I didn't have that much trouble training my levain. The trick was to double the levain, let it double, and repeat (by discarding half). After two weeks, it could double in 2 days. If anyones tries this, please let me know. The pace is just perfect for one or two loaves a week and it schedules very easily since you only need 3-4 hours total on baking day. Two further refinements: Recently I tried doing the final rise in the ref. as well and it worked fine. After the primary doubled in size, I punched down, stretched and folded, panned and shaped. The dough is placed in a wicker basket, wrapped with 3 layers total of muslin (cotton and cotton/poly), and placed in the ref. 12 hours later it was fully risen and--after docking--went straight into the oven. The result was identical to the RT final rise. With this refinement, you only need to be home during the baking time--perfect for baking without losing your job. Second, my barm is now grown with whole wheat flour, while the final build is done with white flour. The ratio of whole wheat to white is 1:2. I have observed no loss in the lightness of the loaves or the irregularity of the large holes. The flavor is wheaty and excellent. raj --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.4 --------------- From: Julie Boylan Subject: No Knead Bread from NY Times Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 15:57:03 -0800 (PST) I've made this bread twice so far and it has been very well received. I feel that I can stop trying other artisanal type breads. The crust! The crumb! It's wonderful. I only suggest using rice flour on the cloth to nearly eliminate sticking. The first time the bread just fell out of the enameled cast iron pot. The second time it stuck a bit in a spot so I had to pry it out. Delicious with some good cheese and wine and wonderful as toast the next day. Try it, you'll like it. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.5 --------------- From: "Debbie Tower" Subject: No-knead bread Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 20:08:24 -0500 Hi All, I made this bread yesterday and it was so easy. I mixed it in a glass bowl and let it sit on my counter over night and part of the next day. Then I used my dutch oven and heated it well. I liked the idea of cooking it with a lid to hold in the moisture. The crust was crunchy and it was full of medium to large holes making it nice and chewy. I do agree with the others that it does have a hint of sourdough taste. You'll love this bread once you try it. Debbie in NH --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.6 --------------- From: "Steven Leof" Subject: Boulangerie 140 Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2006 14:03:56 -0000 Have a look at yesterday's entry on David Lebovitz's irreverent blog http://www.davidlebovitz.com/archives/2006/12/140.html for a description of Boulangerie 140 in Paris. Has anyone compiled a list of the better bread blogs? I can contribute a few if there's interest. Perhaps Reggie and Jeff would consider adding some of the best to the Links section of the web site? Steven Leof --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.7 --------------- From: Haack Carolyn Subject: NY Times followup article on no-knead bread Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2006 03:22:05 -0800 (PST) December 6, 2006 The Minimalist No Kneading, but Some Fine-Tuning MARK BITTMAN LAST month I wrote about Jim Lahey, the owner of Sullivan Street Bakery on West 47th Street in Manhattan, and his clever way to produce a European-style boule at home. Mr. Lahey's recipe calls for very little yeast, a wet dough, long rising times and baking in a closed, preheated pot. My results with Mr. Lahey's method have been beyond satisfying. Happily, so have those of most readers. In the last few weeks Jim Lahey's recipe has been translated into German, baked in Togo, discussed on more than 200 blogs and written about in other newspapers. It has changed the lives (their words, not mine) of veteran and novice bakers. It has also generated enough questions to warrant further discussion here. The topics are more or less in the order of the quantity of inquiries. WEIGHT VS. VOLUME The original recipe contained volume measures, but for those who prefer to useweight, here are the measurements: 430 grams of flour, 345 grams of water,1 gram of yeast and 8 grams of salt. With experience, many people will stop measuring altogether and add just enough water to make the dough almost too wet to handle. SALT Many people, me included, felt Mr. Lahey's bread was not salty enough. Yes, you can use more salt and it won't significantly affect the rising time. I've settled at just under a tablespoon. YEAST Instant yeast, called for in the recipe, is also called rapid-rise yeast. But you can use whatever yeast you like. Active dry yeast can be used without proofing (soaking it to make sure it's active). TIMING About 18 hours is the preferred initial rising time. Some readers have cut this to as little as eight hours and reported little difference. I have not had much luck with shorter times, but I have gone nearly 24 hours without a problem. Room temperature will affect the rising time, and so will the temperature of the water you add (I start with tepid). Like many other people, I'm eager to see what effect warmer weather will have. But to those who have moved the rising dough around the room trying to find the 70-degree F sweet spot: please stop. Any normal room temperature is fine. Just wait until you see bubbles and well-developed gluten - the long strands that cling to the sides of the bowl when you tilt it - before proceeding. THE SECOND RISE Mr. Lahey originally suggested one to two hours, but two to three is more like it, in my experience. (Ambient temperatures in the summer will probably knock this time down some.) Some readers almost entirely skipped this rise, shaping the dough after the first rise and letting it rest while the pot and oven preheat; this is worth trying, of course. OTHER FLOURS Up to 30 percent whole-grain flour works consistently and well, and 50 percent whole-wheat is also excellent. At least one reader used 100 percent whole-wheat and reported "great crust but somewhat inferior crumb," which sounds promising. I've kept rye, which is delicious but notoriously impossible to get to rise, to about 20 percent. There is room to experiment. FLAVORINGS The best time to add caraway seeds, chopped olives, onions, cheese, walnuts, raisins or whatever other traditional bread flavorings you like is after you've mixed the dough. But it's not the only time; you can fold in ingredients before the second rising. OTHER SHAPES Baguettes in fish steamers, rolls in muffin tins or classic loaves in loaf pans: if you can imagine it, and stay roughly within the pattern, it will work. COVERING BETWEEN RISES A Silpat mat under the dough is a clever idea (not mine). Plastic wrap can be used as a top layer in place of a second towel. THE POT The size matters, but not much. I have settled on a smaller pot than Mr. Lahey has, about three or four quarts. This produces a higher loaf, which many people prefer - again, me included. I'm using cast iron. Readers have reported success with just about every available material. Note that the lid handles on Le Creuset pots can only withstand temperatures up to 400 F. So avoid using them, or remove the handle first. BAKING You can increase the initial temperature to 500 F for more rapid browning, but be careful; I scorched a loaf containing whole-wheat flour by doing this. Yes, you can reduce the length of time the pot is covered to 20 minutes from 30, and then increase the time the loaf bakes uncovered. Most people have had a good experience baking for an additional 30 minutes once the pot is uncovered. As these answers demonstrate, almost everything about Mr. Lahey's bread is flexible, within limits. As we experiment, we will have failures. (Like the time I stopped adding flour because the phone rang, and didn't realize it until 18 hours later. Even this, however, was reparable). This method is going to have people experimenting, and largely succeeding, until something better comes along. It may be quite a while. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.8 --------------- From: "Russell Fletcher" Subject: Carl Griffith's 1847 Oregon Trail Sourdough Starter Date: Fri, 8 Dec 2006 08:48:44 -0800 Has anyone tried Carl Griffith's 1847 Oregon Trail Sourdough Starter? I just tried to activate my sample last night and it just sat there. I was extra careful, and even had my wife double check the temperature of the water. I followed the instructions, then when it failed after about 10 hours, tried a little warmer water. No success so far. Is it worth waiting several weeks to get another sample and trying again or do I just order something else off the internet? (I can't find sourdough starter anywhere around here. Presuming that I should try a different starter, has anyone tried any of the starters from King Arthur Flour (The Baker's Catalogue)? Thanks for the help. Russ -- Russell Fletcher pastordic @ gmail.com Battle Ground, WA --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.9 --------------- From: Pam Binder Subject: leaven for no-gluten flours Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 00:05:35 -0800 Hello! I am looking for different types of leavens to use with no gluten flours. Can you help me? I am also looking for non gluten recipes. Thank you, Pamela Binder --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.10 --------------- From: "Alice A. Thurman" Subject: the recipes that come with the dak turbo 2 Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2006 13:13:55 -0800 Hi, I'm Alice at . I am in a hurry-up tizzy! having just moved to Dallas Oregon I sort of "live" out of my storage at present. Went there the other day and got my Dak and now I can't use it because I cannot find the 2 or 3 recipe books that are used exclusively for the dak. I am FRUSTRATED I want to make some bread and I usually only "use" it around this time of year, but this time of year is going to "last longer" than where I was from and I need help now!. Can you help me? You know the one that 'my mother's white bread and french bread and beer bread and cheese bread' etc. is in. Thanks, Alice Allyn Thurman --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.11 --------------- From: Margaret Cope Subject: Fabulous Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 13:59:19 -0500 I made my first loaf of slow rise as in NYTimes today. It is wonderful. No mishaps. I baked it in a Roseville Ohio 3 Quart bowl with an old fashioned Pyrex lid. Now for experimenting with a bit of sourdough starter for flavor and abit of whole wheat flour. I hope the bowl survives. Amazingly no greasing of the bowl and it came out perfectly. Speedy recovery to Peter Reinhard whose latest blog reported his misery. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.12 --------------- From: "Gerald Ulett" Subject: Convection Oven Baking Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:04:58 -0800 My oven quit working and the cost of repairs were about the same as replacing it with a new conventional oven. Instead I have chosen to spend a little more and buy a convection oven. Two problems! One is that it will not be installed until December 22st. The second is that I do not know how it will affect my bread baking - both bread and rolls. Can anyone help me, please. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.13 --------------- From: "Cindy DeCesare" Subject: New York Times - No Knead Bread Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 21:31:33 -0600 ------=_Part_60075_9825718.1164598293615 I need advice! On Thanksgiving (what was I thinking), I thought I would try the New York Times recipe for No Knead bread. I watched the video and printed out Rose Levy Beranbaum's recipe for the bread. Everything looked fine as I was ready to place the dough into the very hot La Cruset pan, then the dough stuck to the floured towel......which wasn't my biggest problem. When the bread was finished baking, I couldn't get it out of the pan! It was stuck fast. It was over cooked, some of the edges were blackened. When it finally was removed, the bottom stayed in the pan. I tasted the middle, but the rest ended up in the garbage. I believe I should have followed Rose's suggestion of a 450 degree oven. Since the pan is heated in a 500 F oven, greasing the pan is out of the question. How would the bread not stick? Did any of you have a similar problem? I'd so appreciate any advice, since I want to try this recipe again. My thanks, Cindy PS - We were not bread-less on Thanksgiving, fortunately the buttermilk rolls and spinach roll came out just fine. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.14 --------------- From: "Karen Mays-Wolke" Subject: no-knead with whole wheat Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 19:37:47 -0800 I have tried the 'no-knead' bread from the NY Times recipe with a combination of King Arthur's 'white' whole wheat flour and some whole wheat flour I ground from wheat berries. The flavor was fantastic and the texture was just as good as the loaf I earlier tried witih white flour. I am used to spending hours of time making our bread from sourdough starter with lots of time involved feeding the starter, going through the several steps involved in sourdough bread, and lots of kneading. I may never go back as this bread was wonderful. Has anyone tried adding sourdough starter to this bread? Karen in very very rainy Oregon (but rainy days are great for bread-baking) --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.15 --------------- From: jweissmn@his.com Subject: some things NOT to do with the no-knead bread Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 05:17:38 -0500 I had some stinkers until I followed these hints: 1) Don't raise the temperature above 450 F. At least in my oven higher temperatures result in thick crust and gummy bread. 2) For the original 3-cup recipe, use the amount of water in the video (1.5 cups) not the amount in the printed recipe. 3) Don't use too large a pot for the recipe. A 3-cup bread recipe in a huge 8-quart pot spreads out too much. Either up the loaf size or use a smaller pot. Loaves are better now. - Jessica --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v106.n046.16 --------------- From: "Steven Leof" Subject: Paris Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 10:42:47 -0000 Thanks to all of you who responded to my queries on bakeries in Paris and Eric Kayser. To Diane Purkiss and other travellers to London: artisan bread here has come a long way. There are now a number of fine bakeries; the following is but a selection: - & Clarke's, - Breads Etcetera - De Gustibus - Euphorium Bakery, 202, Upper Street, N1 or 26a Chapel Market, N1 or 45, South End Road, NW3 - Exeter Street Bakery (tel: 020 8992 7748) - Flour Power City - Le Pain Quotidien - Lighthouse Bakery - Poilaine (46, Elizabeth Street, SW1) For information about artisan bread baking in the UK see Dan Lepard's great site Regarding Ladurée, they now have a location at Harrods in London. Finally, though it's off topic I can't help but mention that London has a growing number of high end chocolate shops. L'Artisan du Chocolat at 89 Lower Sloane Street, SW1 is a fine example; their liquid salted caramels alone are worth the trip. --------------- END bread-bakers.v106.n046 --------------- Copyright (c) 1996-2006 Regina Dwork and Jeffrey Dwork All Rights Reserved