From: Jencybuck@aol.com
Subject: killing yeast
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 1997 21:53:16 -0400 (EDT)
>
> I have a question. After spending the last 3 days baking bread, the
>only one that turned out right was a mix. Not even the one I did on the
>dough only cycle was right. Most tasted ok, but either fell on top or just
>did not rise.
Hi Dawn,
There are several things happening at once here, that may complicate your
efforts.
Falling on top during baking is a separate problem from not rising at all.
Yeast can be a tricky little critter. So can the flours you choose to use.
I'm going to assume here that all your trials were made with the same bread
machine.
Bread, even with a machine, is not always the same each time you bake.
_About Yeast_
The first thought I have here is that your mix was kept separately from
your other yeasts and flours. If your yeasts are old, or have been badly
stored--even before you bought them, they might not be very lively. The
machine bread mix may simply have had a fresher yeast package. You can
"proof" your yeast (that is, prove it is alive) before you use it. Take
some of the flour and some of the water for the recipe and stir it together
(try this with about 1/2 cup of water, and about 1/2 cup of the flour. A
tiny pinch of sugar can be helpful too. Make sure this water isn't any
warmer than your hands. If it feels warmer than your breath, it is too
warm. Lots of modern yeasts don't mind water even on the "almost cool"
side, though this may slow them a little, it certainly will not kill them.
Add your yeast. Put it someplace cozy and out of drafts. Inside your oven
with *just* the light on can be a good place. (Try for around 80-85
degrees F.) Look at it in around 20 to 40 minutes. If it is bubbly, it is
alive.
In the old days one gave the yeast a head-start in this way, before adding
it to the rest of the ingredients. You can start the whole amount of yeast
called for in your recipe this way, or you can start only part of it, and
add the rest as you follow your recipe.
If it is not bubbly, or is only a little bit bubbly, I'd say your yeast is
old and needs to be replaced. Lots of folks in this list--myself
included--get good results from Red Star. I have tried several brands.
Brand really does make a difference. Keep it in the refrigerator until you
plan to use it. If you have _more_ trouble with the new yeast, try using
bottled water. The water from the tap may have just enough chlorine in it
to injure the yeast. I did an experiment using the same yeast with tap
water and with bottled water, and the yeast was twice as vigorous with the
bottled water as with the tap water in my house.
_Other Ingredients_
Too much salt can also inhibit the yeast. Don't add more than 1 tsp. for
each 3 cups of flour.
*Too much* sugar can slow the yeast--Be sure that you don't have more than
2 Tablespoons for each 3 cups of flour, or --if the recipe calls for more--
it also calls for slightly more (2-3 tsp) of yeast. You will see this in
"sweet dough" recipes.
Your next problem is with heavy loaves, or with sinking during baking. You
said:
>I am getting 3 to 4 inch long loaves, heavy too. I have been
>ever so careful to follow recipes & direction ever so carefully. The bread
>mix coming out well means the machine is alright... Yes?
Yes.
The machine provides a standard environment, and the folks who package the
flour for the mix are probably careful to check how much moisture is in the
flour. This can vary by as much as 15 %. This is why bread recipes in
cookbooks give a "range" of flour amounts. The recipe is trying to allow
for the dry flour of a baker in Arizona, and the humid flour of a baker in
New Orleans. Humidity varies with storage and milling conditions. You
might find that the first loaf you make from each _different_ bag of flour
will turn out differently than the previous batch.
If the loaf drops during baking or just before baking, it means the yeast
is doing just fine, but the gluten strands in the flour have been
over-stretched, and have broken. This can happen at the last minute during
the start of the bake cycle because the rising steam of your baking dough
gives it enough of an "oomph" to break the delicate structure, and it
collapses before it bakes to a hard crust. So, a loaf that sinks like that
needs just a little bit less water. It is too wet. Do the same thing you
did to get that loaf, but cut the water by a Tablespoon or so. If it seems
to sit in the bread machine and hardly rise at all, or come out like a
rock, it may not have had enough water. Try the same thing but increase
the water a little bit. This is trickier than reducing the water.
A very useful "rule of thumb" is to watch the machine during the first
stirring and kneading phase. The dough should stir itself into a firm
ball, with very little or _no_ dough sticking to the sides of the pan. It
should sort of move and flow in shape just a little each time the paddle
pauses. If it is sticking to the sides, add a Tablespoon of flour or maybe
two. This will dry up the loaf and it will not collapse so easily when it
bakes. If it is not very elastic and flowing, add a Tablespoon of water.
(You will probably not need to add two.)
"Heavy" loaves are a different problem yet--and from your description I can
only make a guess. One kind of "heavy" comes from putting the bread in too
cool a place too soon after it is baked. The inside of the loaf gets dense
and kind of clammy. Let the loaf come to room temperature before you cut
or wrap it. Don't store it in the refrigerator.
Another kind of "heavy" comes from using whole-grain flours, which are
dense and can be more moist than a white flour. The yeast will have to
"work very hard" to raise a whole wheat dough--this is why you give it
longer, and sometimes you add a little more yeast to a whole wheat recipe
than to a white one. The machine can make a difference too. Kneading the
dough is done to "develop the gluten"...to make the strong strands of
protein that give the loaf its texture, or its "crumb." If you don't knead
it enough, it can't create the structure that will allow it to rise. The
springly, tiny little "ropes" of gluten are just not in the dough. This
means that a machine that is set to too short a cycle or which has a weak
motor will not "beat" the dough enough, and the loaf will be dense,
low-rising, and kind of "crumbly" when sliced. Check to see that you are
using a flour that is "meant" for bread baking. Those flours have higher
gluten (protein) content than all-purpose or cake flour. This has to do
with the kind of wheat you use. If you are experimenting with loaves using
other flours than wheat, (such as soy, or amaranth or rye) your gluten
content may be too small and all you will get is a rock instead of a
springy loaf.
> I have never been able to work with yeast. baking pwer & soda yes, but
>not yeast. I remember as a small child, my grandmother shooing me out of the
>kitchen while she baked (everything), telling me I'd kill the yeast. Could
>this really, actually be true?
Your grandmother thought she was being funny. She might have been worried
that you would open the oven where the bread may have been resting/rising.
She may have been worried that you'd get underfoot. She may have just
wanted to give you a little sense of magical power...and didn't think about
how negative it sounded. Relax. You can not kill the yeast just by being
in the room. Wild yeasts live everywhere around us. They are simple but
strong creatures who survive in some amazing places. It is far more likely
that if the yeast are dying, it is because the water is too hot or they
were stored too long or too hot.
> If so, why can I not use a bread machine? After all, I am not
>touching the yeast. Could just being in the room with it, kill it like
>gramma said?
Bread machines take out a lot of variables in bread making, and they
simplify our part, but they do not perform the whole task, and they do not
do miracles. They can not revive a yeast that is dead (or dying) before
you buy it. It sounds to me as though you DID GET several living loaves,
but that sometimes your water was too much--your flour may have been a
little more moist than the flour used by the writer of your recipe. It
happens. It happens to me about one time in 5.
You must help the process. Try again with fresh yeast, maybe some bottled
water, and watch the stirring to see that the proportions of your water and
flour are right for your machine and for this batch of flour. Be sure at
least 2/3 of the ingredients of any loaf you make is from wheat or some
other flour that has gluten. Not more than 1/3 should be other flours, or
beans or additives of any sort. Make sure you have a whole wheat cycle for
your heavy doughs.
That should do it.
Good luck.
Chris Olmstead